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Old Jun 18th 2017, 08:17 AM   #251
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Originally Posted by Lanark View Post
That's my understanding too L twin has 90 ish degrees between cylinders.

Fair to say that V4 is much more marketable than L4. Even if Ducati do build an L4 they may badge it a V4
Well in cars the V8 is traditionally 90 degrees. 90 degrees is the most vibration free configuration. When you stray from 90 you then need to start adding ways to dampen the vibration. The L Twin is nothing more than the best angle V Twin layed over. The reason some go with a lesser angle V is for making a tighter package so that the engine can be moved further forward. What will always hurt the Desmo engines is also one of its key advantages, the desmodromic valve system. The heads have to be taller to accommodate this. All trade offs.
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Old Jun 18th 2017, 03:47 PM   #252
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Old Jun 18th 2017, 03:48 PM   #253
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Old Jun 18th 2017, 06:56 PM   #254
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Originally Posted by Twistedracer View Post
Well in cars the V8 is traditionally 90 degrees. 90 degrees is the most vibration free configuration. When you stray from 90 you then need to start adding ways to dampen the vibration. The L Twin is nothing more than the best angle V Twin layed over. The reason some go with a lesser angle V is for making a tighter package so that the engine can be moved further forward. What will always hurt the Desmo engines is also one of its key advantages, the desmodromic valve system. The heads have to be taller to accommodate this. All trade offs.
Also 90 degrees divides into 720 degrees evenly. Whatever angle you bank your cylinders at needs to be an even function of 720 degrees (4 stroke, each cylinder fires every other time the piston comes up). I remember the Renault formula 1 team from the V-10 era banked their cylinders at a weird angle other than 90.
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Old Jun 19th 2017, 05:22 PM   #255
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The end is near, looks like a tricolore to farewell the Pani.

Keep your eyes peeled on Friday 7th July.

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Old Jun 19th 2017, 09:04 PM   #256
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Ill still keep my twin even when the V4 comes out. No point to sell it or trade it in. I think of all the bikes Ive had or even have now the 1299 Panigale is the one I want to keep. Call me nostalgic but I want to hold on it as a part of the twin history. Maybe Ill wait a year after the V4 comes out to see if it has any kinks to work out but if its trickled down technology from motogp then it could be proven already and its most likely been in the works for a while now. I'd trade in or sell my 2015 BMW S1000R for a Ducati V4 but still keep both the 1299 and 2016 S1000RR. My friends dad still has his 1990 851, 1993 888, 1995 916 and of course his 2015 1299R. Ive ridden his 851, 888, and 916. Love all of them. Im sure the V4 will be off the charts. Buts a twin is still a twin. Im sure most will agree with me here
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Old Jun 19th 2017, 09:27 PM   #257
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Originally Posted by cycler View Post
Ill still keep my twin even when the V4 comes out. No point to sell it or trade it in. I think of all the bikes Ive had or even have now the 1299 Panigale is the one I want to keep. Call me nostalgic but I want to hold on it as a part of the twin history. Maybe Ill wait a year after the V4 comes out to see if it has any kinks to work out but if its trickled down technology from motogp then it could be proven already and its most likely been in the works for a while now. I'd trade in or sell my 2015 BMW S1000R for a Ducati V4 but still keep both the 1299 and 2016 S1000RR. My friends dad still has his 1990 851, 1993 888, 1995 916 and of course his 2015 1299R. Ive ridden his 851, 888, and 916. Love all of them. Im sure the V4 will be off the charts. Buts a twin is still a twin. Im sure most will agree with me here
I feel the exact same way. With the exception of my first bike, the 1299 is the only bike I've owned that I feel like keeping indefinitely. It'll probably be put on track duty when the Trumpet calls it quits.
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Old Jun 19th 2017, 10:37 PM   #258
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Well the reason behind scrapping the twin is emissions sound regs. It's not an obsolete bike and in my mind more desirable for it. Pity that era is coming to a close.


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Old Jun 19th 2017, 11:38 PM   #259
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Originally Posted by Johnnyflies View Post
Well the reason behind scrapping the twin is emissions sound regs. It's not an obsolete bike and in my mind more desirable for it. Pity that era is coming to a close.


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Euro 4/5 is killing off everything 600 won't be around for long, there all going to bigger motors to meet the standard.

Personally they should stop waisting billions to meet these targets and develop next gen powered vehicles and have renewables/next gen power to supply them.
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Old Jun 20th 2017, 04:49 AM   #260
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Originally Posted by Halo2 View Post
Euro 4/5 is killing off everything 600 won't be around for long, there all going to bigger motors to meet the standard.



Personally they should stop waisting billions to meet these targets and develop next gen powered vehicles and have renewables/next gen power to supply them.


They can slap on more restrictive exhausts and the engines can be tuned for fuel economy/co2, but this will kill HP. This will no doubt spur on even more aftermarket development.

They can't pencil autos for renewables, and auto have higher prices and margins, I seriously doubt they make the investment for the cycle market. Nor do motorcycles have the economies of scale.

It's a tough problem for sure.
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