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Old Aug 14th 2017, 02:22 PM   #31
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What did Dovi say at the interview, "I heard him open the throttle early"?

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Old Aug 14th 2017, 02:23 PM   #32
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Cause marc was already on the gas he heard him making the move he didn't have to see him


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Old Aug 14th 2017, 03:26 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by mark419ny View Post
if rossi wasnt stealing a seat from someone better than i wouldnt say a word. he could do the same thing on tech 3 that he is doing on the factory ride. pretty sad that yamaha didnt have the cahones to actually let a first time yamaha rider win the championship because it would make the has been look bad.

maverick was basically untouchable till COTA thats when the tires changed and suddenly the chasis doesnt work for him either. tech 3 is running last years bike and beat out the factory. things that make you go hmmmm

Before I start my reply to your comment above let me do a full disclosure.

I've always been a fan of Valentino Rossi since his first years in the lower classes. However, I don't wear yellow tinted sunglasses and I can clearly see when he has been in the wrong side of the equation or when his demeanor was, let's say, lacking in manners or sportsmanship.

I am equally a fan of Marquez and his sheer talent riding a bike on its edge. And just like with Rossi, I can also uknowledge when his actions were quite risky or reckless.

And I'm also a big fan of whoever rider displays a great effort to win or puts on an amazing race, be it Lorenzo, Dovi, Vinales, Stoner (while he was still competing), Pedrosa, etc.

But that's not the point I'm discussing here, so I'm going to move on with my reply.


__________________________________________________ ___________________


You have stated several times on this forum that Michelin changed the tyre construction during this year to please Rossi. You also mentioned that the tyre Michelin took out was the one that Vinales preferred.
And as a result, that has robbed Vinales of any chance to fight for the title.

You also mentioned that Yamaha followed Rossi's suggestions about the development of the new chassis, which was contrary to what Vinales wanted.
And as a result, and I'm quoting you, that put Vinales in the backseat regarding chassis development and that he was forced to ride the chassis Rossi preferred.

So, let's start with the tyres...

For the first five races of this year (not the first three as you wrongly said), Michelin brought the 06 tyre construction to the races. Since then, Michelin changed the tyre allocation to the 70 construction, which features a stiffer casing.

If you go back to the pre-season test at Valencia late last year, Rossi preferred the 70 tyre, but the majority of the riders preferred the 06 tyre.
So, when the season started, it was the 06 tyre that was offered to the riders.

After the Jerez test this year, many riders voiced their concerns about the 06 tyre being used. And at the LeMans pre-race meeting, a vote was taken. All but three riders (Vinales, Lorenzo and another one that I don't recall now) voted to change the tyre allocation to the stiffer 70 tyre.

So, as you can see, there is no conspiracy to help Rossi with the tyre allocation.

Why did the riders changed their opinion regarding the tyres? Well, I don't have an answer to that but I can speculate that the stress put on the tyres on a pre-season test (Valencia 2016) are nowhere near the stress those tyres are subjected to during a race weekend, where riders put that little extra effort to achieve a good time or to catch the rider in front of them.

If you want to read further, see this article: The tyre that may change everything | Motor Sport Magazine

Now, the Yamaha chassis...

Are you aware that at the Barcelona test, Yamaha brought two new chassis? On the first day of that test, both riders were faster with one of the new chassis (the second one was only tested on tuesday).

Rossi was very pleased with it while Vinales, although faster with it, didn't know what changes had helped him being faster, so he didn't have a clear opinion about that chassis.

After that test I don't recall Yamaha telling us which of the new chassis was chosen. However, at Assen (correct me if I'm wrong), both Rossi and Vinales had one bike with the new chassis and another one with the "old" chassis with which they started the season.

Although there was no clear info from Yamaha on what chasis each rider used at the race, some journalists with access to the paddock mentioned that the most likely situtation was Rossi using the "new" chassis from the Barcelona test; and Vinales was still using the "old" chassis.

It was also said that the "new" chassis Rossi used and liked so much was quite close to the 2016 chassis used by Tech3, while the "old" 2017 chassis was developed more towards the Vinales riding style.

From then on, it is said that each rider is using whichever chassis they prefer. So, Vinales is not being forced to ride a bike he doesn't want to, as you mentioned several times.

If Vinales is not performing as he wished, it's not because Yamaha is holding him off.

You also have to acknowledge that Vinales is yet to hone his analytic and developmental skills since when he crashes, most of the time he goes on to say that he doesn't have a clue about what happened, that he did that lap exactly like he did the previous one, etc.

Perhaps, that's the reason that Yamaha doesn't follow his word blindingly and not some kind of ulterior motive to impair his newly signed rider (and the one they most likely count to succeed for the next years) in favour of Rossi.

And to finish my long reply (sorry for that), how is Rossi taking someone else's seat when he has finished the previous seasons always in second?

If he is finished as a rider as you say, then he also is the best of the rest.
Why would Yamaha replace Rossi when, apart from the seasons he ended behind Lorenzo, he is their best rider?

I'm talking about only the previous seasons. If Rossi ends this season in fourth or below, I'l give you that maybe Yamaha has better options indeed (PR money not withstanding).

To sum up, I think you should restrain your hate towards Rossi a bit. You care more about him losing, than your favourite rider winning.

In my case, I just love the sport. In my opinion, this championship will go to Marquez and I'm really ok with that. If I had to pick a champion for this year I would choose Rossi, just to achieve his 10th title and retire.

After that, I would like Dovi or Pedrosa to win it. It's about time those two have their moment of glory and Dovi has shown great progress this year; not only sheer speed but also his race strategy.

But what if Marquez wins the championship? I'm happy with that too. Reckless moves or not (that's a matter for another discussion), the guy has a tremendous talent, rides that Honda like no other and has helped Honda to make that bike better than the unrideable beast it was two years ago.
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Old Aug 14th 2017, 03:40 PM   #34
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The 060 tire wasn't a concern it was voted on pretty season. Couldn't have maverick run away with it so dorna made a bs vote Just like they took Lorenzo tire away last year they took mavericks away this year. There was no safety concerns. Did they take a vote yes funny how rossi as well as others have voted to harm their competition then vote what's good for them. Anyway rossi has had every advantage ever in racing history. I acknowledge 1 championship 09. He has done 0 since then averaging 1 win a year. I've also never said since week 3 on the tire as cota was week 4 and it still wasn't there. Anyway rossi needs to go. He is a has been and is hurting the championship imo. Yamaha could have been jlo and maverick this year taking on the Honda boys but no we have to hear constantly about how somebody is still In contention.
Rossi has voted against his tire because of Stoner. Has threatened to quit if he didn't get his way on tires. Has sabotaged spies career at Yamaha to make a return. Has forced Lorenzo out and is hampering zarco as we speak.
Let's not forget the bs in 15 because he knew he would blow it.


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Last edited by mark419ny; Aug 14th 2017 at 03:42 PM.
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Old Aug 14th 2017, 03:50 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by mark419ny View Post
that move would have worked if (hate saying if) the tire griped right away and didnt have that wiggle. truth is MM made 3 mistakes towards the end of the race that put dovi ahead where if it didnt happen MM wouldnt have to do that move.
in any event ducati should have walked away with this win and didnt. MM will win number 6 this year and you guys can tell me rossi is back after his second place at qatar.
The move didn't work and was risky and potentially could have taken them both out, end of story. Riders make mistakes and bikes can have issues and that's all part of racing and usually the best bike and rider of the day is victorious. No bad talk about MM here, just the facts.

For the record I've never said Rossi is back and predicted MM to win this year.

Why should Ducati walk away with it? On race day who ever wins wins no matter who is on poll or should have won or walked away with it.

Oh and your aunt would be your uncle if she had balls...
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Old Aug 14th 2017, 03:57 PM   #36
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Aleix said it best (sort of):


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Old Aug 14th 2017, 04:24 PM   #37
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The track is basically a straight. Thays why Ducati should have walked away with it. It was a great race and I also said mm would win the entire thing. Iaonne that move is a crash. Mm the move is brilliant.


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Old Aug 14th 2017, 05:05 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by mark419ny View Post
The 060 tire wasn't a concern it was voted on pretty season. Couldn't have maverick run away with it so dorna made a bs vote Just like they took Lorenzo tire away last year they took mavericks away this year. There was no safety concerns. Did they take a vote yes funny how rossi as well as others have voted to harm their competition then vote what's good for them. Anyway rossi has had every advantage ever in racing history. I acknowledge 1 championship 09. He has done 0 since then averaging 1 win a year. I've also never said since week 3 on the tire as cota was week 4 and it still wasn't there. Anyway rossi needs to go. He is a has been and is hurting the championship imo. Yamaha could have been jlo and maverick this year taking on the Honda boys but no we have to hear constantly about how somebody is still In contention.
Rossi has voted against his tire because of Stoner. Has threatened to quit if he didn't get his way on tires. Has sabotaged spies career at Yamaha to make a return. Has forced Lorenzo out and is hampering zarco as we speak.
Let's not forget the bs in 15 because he knew he would blow it.


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I will not comment on what happened in the past because you are claerly biased against Rossi and hold him accountable of everything that doesn't go your way.

The 06 tyre was chosen in pre-season indeed. Then the season started and I think you remember that the front of the bikes was folding under the chins of most riders.

Then there was a vote to switch the 06 with the 70 tyre, ANd guess what? Twenty riders voted in favour of the 70 tyre.

You say they voted against their competition and accordingly to what suits them better? Didn't everyone do that? The twenty riders that voted for the 70, voted that way not only because of safety concerns but it was obvious they were voting accordingly to what they liked the most, But so dis Vinales and Lorenzo which voted the other way. there's no harm in that.

And may I remind you that Marquez also voted for 70. So, did Crutchlow and whatnot. The 06 carcass was too soft for many riders so they voted against it. Did they impair a bit those that felt more comfortable with the 06? yes, they did. But they were all just for what they believed would be better for them.

That's racing. Should they keep on going with the tyre they disliked just to please their competition?

Do you think if the option to go back to the 06 would be given to Vinales, he wouldn't take it without thinking twice of his rivals?

Now, I have to be honest, and I understand that you can say that that kind of decision should not be taken on a "Safety Comission" meeting, which isn't an "official board", rather just a meeting where riders voice their concerns about track safety but doesn't have the power to change the rules.
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Old Aug 14th 2017, 05:58 PM   #39
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This is why Austria is a Ducati track
https://www.asphaltandrubber.com/mot...7/#more-140772

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Old Aug 14th 2017, 06:05 PM   #40
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I love how rossi fans state I'm a rossi fan but lol. Simple solution you give the choice of both tires. Bottom line like basketball if the Celtics and Lakers aren't good NBA doesn't do as well. Football Cowboys and Raiders. Baseball Yankees. It's all about money simple how would Yamaha look releasing the guy who won 40 % of the titles since 2010 then signing a a first timer to win it in his first year with them all the while keeping a guy that has amd get ready for it. Averaged 1 rave win a year since 2010 where the champion averages 4 wins a year. So let's recap. Champion wins 4 a year Avg. Rossi wins 1 a year = no shot at title


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